What It Takes to Transform Banking

What does it take to disrupt an industry as entrenched as banking and keep evolving once you’ve done it? On this episode of SuiteTalk, Gerrie Fourie, former CEO of Capitec Bank, reflects on what it takes to build a truly client-obsessed organization. He shares lessons on the importance of simplicity and transparency, emphasizes the power of purpose in inspiring others, and offers a unique perspective on the evolving role of a CEO in today's fast-paced environment.

Comments are edited excerpts from our podcast, which you can listen to in full below.

Could you tell us about Capitec and the company’s growth journey?

Gerrie Fourie: We started Capitec in 2000, when we saw a big gap in personal banking. At the time, banking was too complex and inaccessible. We looked at the South African market, particularly at people without financial education or knowledge, and said, “We need to make banking as simple and transparent as possible.”

Then we asked ourselves, “How do we do that?” We went back to the fundamentals—affordability, accessibility, simplicity, and service. That became the company’s foundation.

The first 12 years were about establishing our brand, which took consistency and built trust over time. Once we had that, we realized how critical culture was going to be. And for us, that culture was about being client-obsessed and delivering on our promises.

That mindset also shaped how we see leadership. If you think about small business owners (obsessed with their clients, full of energy, making decisions, and taking ownership), that’s really the role of a CEO. We believe everyone at Capitec should take ownership, be accountable, make decisions, challenge things, and always ask what’s best for our clients.

As the journey continued, we also diversified. We knew we had to become a one-stop shop, not just a bank. That’s when we introduced value-added services such as insurance and business banking.

Before digital banking was widespread, how did you think about reaching clients in the early days?

Gerrie: If you think back to 2000, there was no digital banking. So, from the start, we knew we needed bank branches, and our approach was dominance in a given area. For example, when we launched in Bela-Bela, a town in the Limpopo Province of South Africa, we didn’t just open one branch; we opened five. In the Transkei, a region in the southeastern part of South Africa, we opened 20. We wanted to make sure clients could see and access us everywhere.

We also changed the rules on operating hours. Traditional banks were open from 9:00 a.m. to 3:30 p.m., which didn’t work for most people, so we quickly moved to 8:00 a.m. to 7:00 p.m., and in some places even stayed open until 10:00 p.m.

By 2013 or 2014, we had introduced our app. Today, 95% of all transactions happen on the Capitec app, and that has freed our branches to focus on sales and deeper client interaction.

People often ask why we keep branches in the digital age, but because branches are where relationships happen, they are critical to our success.

How did you determine what clients wanted? Do you rely on instinct, or do you work backwards from pain points?

Gerrie: Working backwards is critical. But equally important is spending time in the market and in our branches with our consultants and clients.

For the first 12 years, I traveled every week just to understand the flow, the needs, and the pain points. Even today, that’s our approach. We look at different segments, different client groups, and push to understand what they need.

What’s helped us most is being obsessed with simplicity and transparency. I always challenge our teams and say, “If you launch a product, it must be at least 20% better than the market.” Otherwise, it’s too hard to sell.

And if you look at the six Ps of marketing—product, price, positioning, promotion, place, and people—we aim to be 20% to 25% better than the competition, forcing us to think differently and innovate in how we design products.

Working backwards is critical. But equally important is spending time in the market and in our branches with our consultants and clients.

How do you avoid the complacency that often comes with growth and profitability?

Gerrie: We constantly look at ourselves from the outside. In the early years, I’d appoint a team of 10 to 15 young people and ask them, “If you were a competitor trying to disrupt us, what would you do?” That forced us to challenge everything, from our budgeting and pricing to our products.

I’ve seen plenty of companies get comfortable making good profits, only to be undercut by competitors. So, we ask ourselves the hard questions: Are we being fair to the client? Are we being fair to ourselves? Do we need to cut processes or features to serve clients better?

Disruption, to me, means not waiting for someone else to do it, but making sure we’re always finding the best way forward for our clients.

It seems like disrupting yourself gets harder. How do you stay hungry, 15 or 20 years in?

Gerrie: You must keep that mindset of disruption. Last year, our budget process found 34 different fees. So, we moved to five: 1, 2, 3, 6, and 10. It cost us a few hundred million South African rand, but it was the right call because it reinforced our fundamentals of simplicity and doing what’s best for clients.

How do you define risk for your business?

Gerrie: In banking, the biggest challenge is often on the operational side, making sure information technology (IT) systems are strong, stable, and reliable. One thing I’ve learned is if you don’t upgrade your systems every four or five years, you create legacy problems. And eventually, the system breaks.

Then there’s credit risk, which is more complex. You must look at the economy, at which industries are performing, and then make decisions based on that information.

But the key is to start with clients, not with risk. The moment you start with risk, you’re already on the wrong foot.

Has your decision-making approach evolved over time?

Gerrie: When I was a younger CEO, I was less certain and second-guessed myself more often. But with experience, I’ve learned it’s better to decide quickly, move forward, and correct if needed.

One thing I dislike are committees because they let people hide from decisions. At Capitec, business owners must make decisions. If the wrong decision was made, that’s okay, but what matters is that decision serves the company, not just an individual or department.

That culture of ownership is essential, because I can’t make every decision in the bank. Big companies often build layers of committees and delegation, but we’ve kept it lean, with only eight layers between me and our consultants. That keeps accountability and ownership alive throughout the organization.

Do you feel you’re more decisive now than five years ago?

Gerrie: In the past, I spent a lot of time deep in the detail, but now I rely on others to handle that depth.

For me, questioning is critical. And it’s not about questioning the person, it’s about questioning the issue itself. That’s when you get to the right answers.

It’s not about questioning the person; it’s about questioning the issue itself.

When you were CEO, how did you approach identifying, developing, and rewarding talent?

Gerrie: It starts with appointing the right people, ensuring cultural fit, defining the right leadership traits, and aligning remuneration. For example, we’ve defined nine specific leadership traits we look for at every level. We even use psychometric tests for both senior and junior appointments, ensuring candidates fit culturally and exhibit the right traits.

Leadership, I believe, is often overcomplicated. For me, it comes down to the “why.” If someone understands why they’re doing something—the purpose, the benefit for clients, the expected outcome—they’ll perform. My job is to make that “why” crystal clear, so everyone knows where they’re going and why it matters. Once that’s established, motivation and direction fall naturally into place.

When did you start using psychometric testing, and how has that evolved?

Gerrie: We started using psychometric tests at the consultant level when we launched Capitec. From the beginning, we were very strict with interviews. And over the last 10 years, psychometric testing has expanded across the organization.

It’s difficult to assess how someone will fit with our leadership traits or culture just from an interview, and I would say I trusted the tests about 60% in the beginning. But now, I rely on them 100%.

And it’s not just about doing the tests for the sake of it. They are designed specifically to measure the qualities we care about.

Doesn’t that run the risk of everyone being the same?

Gerrie: No, because we also look for people who are different. What’s important is that they understand our leadership traits and culture, and that they share the same core values. Once that’s in place, managing them becomes much easier.

When you look at the most successful colleagues you’ve worked with, what are the common traits?

Gerrie: If you look at our leadership team, they all have different personalities, different backgrounds, and different approaches. But they all buy into the same culture: client first. They’re passionate about the brand and about making a difference.

The world is moving faster, communication is instant, and the pressure is higher.

How do you approach tough decisions regarding people who may no longer be the right fit?

Gerrie: I remember being at a Microsoft conference with about 15 CEOs, talking about people. And Charlie Munger asked one question that stuck with me: “What do you do with a loyal person who’s been with you 15 or 20 years, but the company has outgrown them?”

There was dead silence—nobody could answer.

So, at Capitec, we made a deliberate call: when that happens, you need to act decisively. You look after those people, provide a proper package, but you cut the rope.

I’ve also learned you need to be open and direct about performance. Often, when there’s a problem, it’s not one thing, but 5 or 10 small issues that build up. Having robust, honest discussions about performance is a critical part of management, and it’s something we actively encourage.

Do you think it’s harder to be a CEO today than it was when you became CEO in 2014?

Gerrie: Over the last five years, we’ve had to navigate COVID-19, the Russia/Ukraine conflict, and the political shifts with the Trump administration. The world is moving faster, communication is instant, and the pressure is higher. It’s more challenging, yes, but that’s just the pace of the world today.